Drs. Bagley and Schurger discuss their findings regarding how often most people will come in with a lower cervical problem that has been hidden by the Atlas problem. This is a great discussion regarding how sometimes it takes a couple of extra visits to really dial in all the healthcare needs that a person has. We also discuss how we’re trying to get you back to optimal health as quickly as possible. And stick around to hear how we stuffed our faces over the holiday.
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How are you doing?
I am doing good. It is our first recorded episode of 2024. We have had a crazy week already, both of us. This is going to be a little bit disjointed. We have a little bit of a plan for what we want to talk about, but quite honestly, it's 6:20. Dr. Bagley texted me saying, “I put the last one down to rest and I was getting one up.” Honestly, I'm yawning already.
We are going to get our second wind. We are going to kick butt on this episode because all of you need some of this information. Some of you have no idea. Your life is going to change after tuning in to this episode.
Let's address the elephant in the room. Why am I exhausted? I know you're as busy as I am. This is the first day that I had a morning shift, but I think I’ve had 4 new patients in 2 days out of the blue. I'm managing all of that myself. I have people who are saying, “I need to go see Dr. Schurger.” A lot of them just moved to the area and they said, “I think this upper cervical stuff might be for me.”
I love that. I'm never going to complain about being busy or not being able to breathe for a second. I love being busy. It was simple. I'm also the type of doctor who doesn't like when too many people are waiting in the waiting room because it makes me nervous. Second of all, I don't like going to a doctor's office and waiting for a long time.
There are certain professions where it has to happen, like OB-GYN, they could have been called when a thing happens and I get it. In a chiropractic office, we should be able to manage patients effectively. I had people waiting in the waiting room for longer than I liked, maybe 15 to 20 minutes past their appointment time. I hated it. Apologies to any of you that I made you do that. A whole bunch of people had hurt themselves after the holidays.
Can you imagine that?
It was great to see some of them, but you also need to take better care of yourself.
I was the same way. I had one of those new patients start at 1:30, but I was starting my afternoon at 2:30. She took longer than expected because she's a complex PI case from an auto accident. I walked up and everybody was either a hair late or a hair early. By 3:15, I had a full waiting room as I was getting everybody back and forth between the two rooms. I didn't get to my notes until the end of the evening because I was like, “We'll take care of notes at the end.” It saves me about a minute per person.
Still, I don't think I stopped moving until 5:30 or 6:00. I took a nap and then had to get more work done because some of these people were coming in the next day to get their first adjustment. Sure enough, the one young lady is doing much better from getting that first adjustment after that car accident. She's as tall as you. She might be taller. What's funny is I was joking that she might be able to stand herself up straight and hit 6’3”. She said 6’2.5” is the tallest.
I didn't measure her before we adjusted her, but the machine measures 72, but it takes an inch out automatically. She was at 73 after her adjustment and she came out of the resting room and said, “Everything is brighter.” I'm pretty excited. I think she's going to do great. Time will tell, of course. I’m always curious to see how many people have messed themselves up over the break.
I was on vacation officially between Christmas and New Year's. We get back into town on Friday afternoon at 4:30, and at 5:00, I have a half dozen patients waiting for me, including one who's a regular who got in a car accident earlier that week. It's been busy and it's wonderful. I like this. One of my nuns who works in a hospital system commented, “Doc, you want to see 50 people a day?” I'm like, “Yes, I do.” I was enjoying that extra busy afternoon. It was a great opportunity.
One of the things that I thought about was when you have a husband and wife or two family members come in together. One of them starts doing well and fast for care. The other one is a slow changer and everybody is different. I had to have that heart-to-heart conversation with the wife and I was like, “I know your husband is one of those types of getting an adjustment,” and miracle changes. All these changes. His vision is better, his night vision is better, his headaches are pretty much gone and they were constant, and his range of motion is better.
He's a truck driver. Not that it's not important for everyone, but driving a truck at night, you need all of your senses and big trucks too. She manages the business but also is a mom and her symptoms are changing a little bit, but not much change. It's not like better. It's not like, “I feel great.” She feels icky still. That's one of those hard conversations and saying, “It's okay.” You can't ever compare apples to oranges. You can't compare yourself to your husband or anybody else because everybody’s journey is different.
Everybody's journey is different.
You’re starting in different places.
Sometimes, people take longer to heal. I was one of those people. I did see some immediate changes, but it was a good four months before I realized how much better I was. Anyway, that's my little win and story about how it's okay for it to take time.
I see those very regularly. Sometimes, one spouse will notice a change and the other one won't. The worst is when they both notice it. The one says, “I'm not sure if it's a change,” and they play it down. It's like, “Did you have this problem last week?” “Yeah, I suppose. I could do everything that I was supposed to do.” You also have the situation where the wife comes in and she's like, “Doc, something's still not right. Something lower hadn't cleared out yet.”
She was complaining and she had a first rib that was out of place and hadn't released. Give it a week. It probably would've taken care of itself, but it might have knocked her out one more time. I said, “We'll do a little bit of a tap on that,” and that helped her out. She's still complaining about her husband. She's like, “Doc, I don't think he got them clear because he's still snoring.” I'm like, “I’ll keep on looking. I’ll keep on doing my best,” but sometimes these things take a little bit more time. There are other factors that we aren't adding to the equation here that might be playing into the symptoms that we're seeing at the time.
One of the questions, and we talked about this, is if somebody comes in and needs a C1 adjustment and then the next day or two days later, they come in and need a different adjustment like C2. Why does that happen?
I think there are layers. I joke that we are like ogres. We have different layers, like an onion.
Maybe like a trifle. Why can't it be a trifle? Everybody likes a trifle.
That is a good reference. We should start using trifle now. I like that better. We have different things going on at any given time. There are two different ways to approach this. The first way is that we have injury A that we are healing through over time, and this doesn't necessarily get into C1 and then a couple of weeks later, at C2.
This gets into the way the atlas had gone out as we'd been adjusting them from the right and then, 4 or 5 months down the road, that adjustment from the right wasn't clearing them out. You take a new picture and you're like, “I have a new angle. We are going to have a better adjustment on the left.” Sure enough, we adjust them on the left.
It’s a very similar adjustment in regards to how they have gone out of place, but it is a big change for how we are approaching it. We've probably healed past one injury and now we have a new injury. It’s not something that happened recently, but an older injury that is now surfacing to a new need to get fixed. That's one way to approach that.
Sometimes we'll have a situation where they’re like, “Doc, something is lingering.” We went in there, and we checked it and did not find anything. We look for a couple of visits and then all of a sudden, it pops up. What I think is we have two things going on. One, neurologically, the atlas is a prime. I don't know whether or not the doctors are primed for it or whether or not the body recognizes that the atlas has a huge component to the healing process.
So much so that if the atlas is out of place and the others aren't to a similar level of impairment, it’s not the right word but it's close, then maybe both of them will show up, the atlas and the axis or the atlas and C3. Generally, what I suspect is the atlas being out of place overwhelms the nervous system so much that even those C2, C3, or C4, maybe not all three of those, but one of those might still be a problem.
It's so overs shined by the atlas that unless the atlas is properly back in alignment and staying there, those others don't show up to any significant degree. Whether or not that is a situation where the body says, “I'm ready to address those lower ones,” because that other injury has finally come up to the surface or because it is overshadowed still by something of the atlas not being as clear as we would like it to be.
I'm so glad you brought this up the way you did and that we haven't pre-talked about this because I feel the same way. I don't think this is taught. They don't discuss it the way we're discussing it here. You're 100% on track with it because I see the same thing in my office where C1 is blazing out and I can't see anything else. They could have seven other misalignments, but I can only see that because C1 is so impaired or impairing the nervous system, we have to adjust it.
We adjust it. Late links will come back to even and the scan clears out, but those other things are still there and they're still present and we neurologically can't see it until C1 is stabilized. I do explain that to my patients in a very similar way as you do. I don't have a double-blind placebo-controlled study that says that that's correct. Considering I see it in the same way that you're seeing it and 2 different doctors in 2 different states, we're on the right track with that.
There are a couple of things to think about here and the reason that it's not discussed amongst the techniques is largely because it's very observational at this point in time. We understand there's not a chiropractor on the planet who adjusts the spine. Let's be specific. There are a lot of chiropractors on the planet who do nutrition and acupuncture. If they ever adjusted a spine, the last spine they adjusted was in the clinic as a student. They did not take it out to their practice. I'm talking about chiropractors who adjust the spine. If you ask any of them where are they going to adjust, gun to their head, they have one segment to adjust to get someone better, they're always going to say atlas because they know that that has the greatest impact.
We understand that and that is something that we can address. What we don't understand is whether there are hierarchies along the spine that may be more important than we should be looking at. Certainly, the Gonstead folks who do a more full spine approach, when you start talking to some of the guys who are teaching and understanding what Dr. Gonstead had figured out, you might see using the thermography breakpoint analysis, multiple spots showing up. Maybe you'll see an L5, L4, T1, T5, C7, and C2; maybe all of those will show up.
You might only choose 3 of them and you're not going to choose 4 and 5 because they're too close to each other. You might choose 5, you might choose 1 of those thoracics or maybe that lower cervical and then C2. They like to keep them spread out because they believe that that is having a neurological impact that is maybe too much for the body to handle if you want to take care of all of them.
We can all say that the atlas has this high priority. This comes back to what the doctors are looking for. Most doctors practicing upper cervical chiropractic think, “What's going on with the atlas today?” Whereas those of us who practice the Blair work certainly have a strong look towards the atlas. We at least acknowledge that those lower ones might have some involvement day in and day out.
How does one segment shine another and how many people have been trained to be sensitive enough to feel, “Something else is out and I know what my atlas feels like.” Case in point. One of my concussion cases was a military Marine. I need to have him on the show sometime soon. He's fantastic. He's been doing some injection work with a doctor down in Myrtle Beach. He's super excited about how much it's changed.
Normally, his atlas is out, and we changed how we adjusted his atlas, which is completely new for him. He got back. He flew down there over the holiday, came back, and said, “Doc, something is off. It's not my atlas or at least it's something different.” Sure enough, his axis was out of place. I adjust his axis and he is like, “Yeah, that's the one.” If I could have seen more non-atlas patient adjustments, most of them were axis. I saw a lot, I’ll be honest.
Me too. I don't know what the holidays did to people but I did.
Maybe everybody relaxed over the holidays and their atlas were able to settle.
I have a lot of atlas holding, but then also a lot of weird stuff today too.
I concur. I am right there with you on that. It begs the question, what is the body available to heal? One of the worst comments, not towards me and my practice, but one of the comments that I had, I ran into somebody randomly. We were talking shop and he knew that I was a chiropractor. The comment that was made was, “The thing I don't like about chiropractors is they don't get all of the segments that need to be adjusted and I have to come back for another visit.”
I thought about that for a second and I know that's not the case, but why isn't that the case, and what else is going on and how do we explain it to patients? This has been at least a decade running through my brain. How do we address the person who thinks that we're not doing everything we can on that visit as opposed to addressing the fact that we've done everything that can be done on that visit?
We also have to give the body a chance to heal. That's what I feel like it's the instant fix mentality of I take a pill and I feel better. Chiropractic does not fit into that peg. That's a square peg and a round hole. It doesn't fit. The way I explain it is like, “Doc, I don't think you got it.” I'm like, “You are in alignment at this point. Your body is catching up with that. You can't feel it immediately. It's not an instant fix.” I say, “I wish it was an instant fix. If I could snap my fingers and make you feel 100%, I would do that, but that's not how our bodies work and it's okay. I bet tomorrow, you will be feeling a little bit better. If I do more at this point, I will hurt you. I'm not going to do that.”
It's the instant fix mentality of "I take a pill, I feel better." Chiropractic does not fit into that.
The other way to think about this is if you go into the gym and you say, “I'm going to bench the bar plus four plates. Can you do that? Maybe you can bench the bar.”
There are those wooden plates.
If you want to bench 225, can you do that first? If you can't do that, where do you have to start? You have to start somewhere lesser. Can you even do the bar? Do you have good form on the bar? Everything is a progression in life, even getting adjusted. I'm all about what the fastest and shortest distance between two points is. How can you do things smarter and more efficiently to get from point A to point B?
In our case, I want to move from not being healthy to being healthy and moving in that direction. What's the fastest way? Getting your atlas checked and adjusted is going to be the fastest way. Maybe we'll have a couple of corrections in between. There are so many things that we have to learn about their paths. Some paths are better than others. I have about three different ways that I can get down to your office. Two of them Google suggests. I look at that and I'm like, “I don't need to take a 3-hour tour to get down to your office in 2.” Google likes to do that. Have you noticed that?
Yes, I have because it took me in a weird way.
It's like, “Why are you making me want to take an extra 45 minutes?” “It's the eco-friendly route.”
I'm like, “No. It’s me being in the carless. It's my eco-friendly.”
It's understanding that we're trying to figure out the shortest point for people to get from point A to point B as efficiently as possible.
We're trying to figure out the shortest route for people to get from point A to point B as efficiently as possible.
Know that we want that for you. We want you to get well quickly, and the quicker the better, and feel well. We want you to not get well but feel well. We want both. There are some chiropractors or doctors who might string people along and make bad decisions that way. When you meet someone, you know if they have integrity or not. You can feel it coming off of them.
I know you have integrity and I try my hardest to have integrity with that. I never ask people to come in more than I think they should. I'm the first one to decrease this care frequency if they're holding longer periods of time. I don't need to see as often, but sometimes it takes more work with certain people and a certain problem.
If you have a new injury, let's say you lifted a box wrong. A lot of people are taking the Christmas decorations down and carrying tubs of stuff down the stairs. I had multiple of those injuries. It's an injury. If you've pushed your ankle, you don't expect it to feel good after a day. It'll take a week or multiple weeks, depending on how bad the injury is. When you hurt your back, neck, spine, or vertebra, it could be very quick or it could take time too. Those soft tissue injuries that surround a misalignment take time to heal.
The adjustment itself, although it’s very quick and easy for us because it's relatively painless, starts in motion the healing. We get to say, “It's going to take some time. It's not time to go run a marathon on this. You need to take the time to heal.” A lot of people don't take that time to heal. They go immediately back to the gym or immediately to lifting things. That reinjures the same problem over and over again.
I have another patient who has been a student for the past couple of years, but his college career is not going in the direction he wanted it to go. He's also getting into a bunch of courses that don't appeal to him the way they wanted to. He's back to work. He's working as a laborer, making good money, and doing work. Now he's going from needing to get checked and adjusted once every 3 or 4 weeks to “Maybe we should get you in every 2,” because he's doing all this extra work and he's more physically active.
He changed what he was doing. That change then consequently gets him in a situation where he's like, “I need to take care of my body just like I take care of any other of my tools and make sure my head is on straight.” He was saying that in the past two days, he's having a migraine. He texted me, “Doc, when's my next appointment?” I'm like, “If you didn't get texted today to tell you that you have an appointment today, we probably should schedule you for today since you're asking to get an appointment for today.”
That's always a fun text that's like, “When's my next appointment?” “If you're texting me, it's today.”
That is accurate. We're not doing magic pills that immediately change symptoms. We're not talking about things that happen overnight with minimal problems. Let's also address some of the supplements that are going on. We've talked about magnesium in the past as being something good for people. A lot of people will notice an immediate improvement in sleep by taking magnesium before bed. It’s so fast. It’s amazing.
It's a good sleep too. It doesn't feel like a drug sleep. Sometimes, even melatonin will feel like a drug sleep to me. I'm taking magnesium glycinate before bed. I know you take a different type.
I take a malate glycinate, something else, plus magnesium 3 and 8. I'm technically taking four different forms.
I take all the magnesium all the time.
The crazy thing is Tuesday night, I was good about it. I was good about it Monday night and felt good for those days. Not that I didn't feel good waking up this morning, but I know I forgot to take them last night. Sure enough, my recovery was down. Not that I'm feeling tired and didn't give my best, but I can feel I will go to bed early tonight or, at the very least, fall asleep in front of the TV faster.
Don't tell people that. That is bad.
No. I'm in my recliner and I'm in a good posture. I turn off the TV. The other thing that I'm going to point out since I’ve put these out, is Omega-3s. This is another one of those things that are going to take a long time to see benefits. I shouldn't say a long time. You might get a quick benefit early on.
It might lower inflammation pretty quickly.
I think the inflammation is what's going to take some time. You might notice your skin looking better by taking it.
I got a skin thing with that. Here's one of my secrets. When you go on vacation and get a sunburn or a sunburn in general, I triple up on Omega-3s. I take maybe two twice a day or 2 or 3 times a day. Typically, it's one pill that you take and the sunburn gets better so much faster. Don't get sunburn in general, but sometimes it happens.
Interestingly, the standard process has a product called Cataplex F. I'm like, “What is in this product?” It is an essential fatty acid. Fish oils. It's the same thing. It's not a fish oil capsule from standard, but it's trying to deliver that same fatty acid profile that helps say, “Bring this into the cell properly.” Understanding that a lot of sunburns are simply an imbalance of Vitamin D to your body's mineral content in the cells because Vitamin D doesn't care whether or not the minerals are in your gut or your cells. It's pulling all of the minerals into the bloodstream when you get that high exposure. If you can force them back into the cells, you have less of a problem with that burn as well.
Is that one of the things that you would also take an extra dose of Vitamin D after getting sun exposure like that or not?
No, definitely not because you had the dose of Vitamin D. You don't need more Vitamin D at that point in time. You need something else to counter that. As you said about the fish oils, I like Cataplex F. Of course, my first choice so that I don't have any problems with this is the carnivore diet. Quite honestly, since I’ve been on the carnivore diet, I don't burn. It is surprisingly a solution. Everyone is like, “What's the best superfood?” It's beef.
Funny story, talking about meat. We got done with the holidays. At Christmas time, normally, we haven't had everyone coming back for a while. It was the first time that all the siblings were at the house, plus all the grandchildren. It was a wild time. My brother Dave doesn't come to the family gatherings as much. I don't know. Dave's angry.
I did make a comment to his wife that I don't think I’ve seen them in what feels like a decade, but it's certainly been two years. Anyway, I made this brisket. I'm experimenting with times and have him try it because I’ve already tasted it and wanted to get his opinion. He takes a piece and he’s like, “It’s good.” That's high praise from Dave.
We were all like, “That was the best thing ever.” They complain about me telling my sister that she didn't temper her chocolate turtles properly because they're melting in my fingers. I'm like, “I know.” They're giving me grief because I'm bringing up the fact that she didn't do them right. As I kept on stuffing my face full of chocolate turtles because they were so good,
That's the thing. Over the holidays, we sometimes indulge in our sweets or something like that. What I did was threw all that crap away. There was still stuff left in the pantry and now it's gone. Now I have my meat and vegetables. I know you don't eat the vegetables. I'm sorry to say the V word in front of you.
I'm okay. I will not die.
I'm back on my meat and vegetables and I feel so much better.
It's so fast. The crazy thing is this. Did you notice how, in the first couple of days, you were craving the stuff that you had thrown away? It is addicting. Our food supply is designed. Designed is the right word. I don't want to say it's poison, but it's poison.
It's designed to be an addictive poison.
One of my patients was complaining about her fibromyalgia, but she went to a place called Ollie's. Are you familiar with that?
Yeah. We have one right by my house now.
That might've been the one she went to. She walks in there and sees Boston Cream Pop-Tarts.
They're probably almost out of date, by the way, because that's what Ollie's about. It’s stuff that's about to go out of date.
The other side of it is I'm like, “That's pure diabetes.” I miss Boston cream donuts, but not that much.
I can't have Pop-Tarts in my house because I freaking love them. If I had one day where I was like, “I'm going to eat whatever I want,” you put all of the things in front of me, like all of the brownies and cookies and Pop-Tarts is one of them, like a strawberry Pop-Tart or cherry Pop-Tart, I'm all over that one. It's a chemical storm that my body craves once I eat one. It's a package of two serving sizes. Of course, you eat the second one. How much do you suffer after that too? Let's say you've been eating well for a week now or for 3 or 4 weeks.
That one moment where you're like, “I'm going to eat this Pop-Tart,” you have a choice at that point. You can eat it and say, “That's the one thing I'm going to do and I'm right back to where I'm supposed to be.” You can do that. Now you've turned on that center in your brain that says, “Just one more and one more thing.” You start craving that. You know those four other Pop-Tarts are sitting in the back of the pantry. It’s just one box. It's like cigarettes. You have one more and then you go another pack, another pack and then you're back to addiction.
The worst part is that in about a week or two after this episode gets released, Girl Scout cookies will be everywhere.
It's Girl Scout cookie time. It is happening.
Here's the worst part. Realize that a serving size of Thin Mints isn't two cookies. It is one sleeve. It is the whole sleeve. There are two servings in that box and it's a sleeve of Thin Mints. You all know that that is a true statement because it is that addicting.
You eat two and you may even put them in the freezer because they're delicious in the freezer. You will go back to that freezer and go back and back. At some point, you'll be out of cookies and you'll be sad. You're also going to be sitting in your soul, and then your knees are going to start to hurt when you go up and down the stairs. That's me because the inflammation levels go straight up. What do you do when you go to the grocery store? You buy more of that crap because now you've started the cycle again. Don't do it. If you want to support the Girl Scouts, you do not have to buy their cookies. You can buy cookies for servicemen or overseas service people.
Just write them a check. I write them a check because all they're looking to do is they're going looking to do their jamborees or their trips or whatever. We don't need to feed a cookie industry and literal cookie monsters.
A good name for the show should be Cookie Monsters.
We'll talk about Cookie Monster. The other problem was that my sister-in-law knows that I love seven-layer bars and makes them gluten-free. She had these cute little plates, the square plates. She had different cookies on them. On both of the plates, she had two of them on the table. I could pick the one that had a few of them. What she was doing was coming in with this square tin 9 x 9 tray and putting it back.
About the second time that I saw her bringing that tray out, I'm like, “No. Michelle, you're going to put that right here in front of me so that I don't have to reach and you don't have to keep on filling up the plate,” because I knew I was going to eat those things until they were gone or until I decided that I was done with them. Somehow, at 8:00, done. My brain said, “I’ve had enough. I had already had a pound of ground beef earlier. I made sure to eat a bunch of chicken at dinner. I prioritized protein.
The entire week I'm over at my dad's, I expected that brisket to last me a couple of days. It was gone that night because that's how good the brisket was. It wasn't just Dave and I that liked the brisket, but Dad had three hams. Instead of doing the packet glaze with all sorts of extra chemicals and garbage in it, we put butter and honey together on it.
You guys make your own honey, don't you?
We do. The bees make the honey. We harvest it.
I know, but you harvest the honey.
We did that, and honestly, every time that I had a chance to eat ham, I ate ham. I ran some numbers. Jean had bought me a couple of chuck roasts because I was out of beef and I knew I needed beef daily in my diet. She gets these two-and-a-half-pound chuck roasts. I smoke both of them. I proceed to eat one on one day and then the next, the next. I'm probably also eating a pound or more of ham on those same days. I probably put down anywhere close to 4,000 calories of meat. All of that protein is protein and my body says, “You're fine.” I'm still a little bit higher as far as the scale.
I want to put a little disclaimer. You are not necessarily trying to lose any weight at this point. You're trying to maintain and build muscle, correct?
I would like to lose some body fat at this point. The new program I'm on is doing that.
I'm saying for people tuning in, you do not need 4,000 calories of protein. You, personally but that person tuning in probably does not need 4,000 calories of meat in a day unless you're an elite athlete.
No, because I was listening to a guy down in New Zealand. What's his name? He was on John Baker's Carnivore podcast. He said he did about a couple of weeks’ worth of 6,500 calories a day of beef, just red meat. He lost 15 pounds. I'm thinking I might have to try that because, quite honestly, I'm also trying to build muscle.
How many ounces of beef would that be?
I’ll look at what the math was from last week that I did.
I know there's fat and stuff like that.
We use chuck roast because chuck roast is probably the best bang for your buck when you go to the grocery store for that. Folks, also bear in mind that I was probably walking anywhere from 10,000 to 15,000 steps. There was a lot of chainsawing and wood chopping going on.
I’ve chopped no wood this year.
Everyone has their own. Thirty-six ounces of Chuck Roast is 3,300 calories.
How many did you say?
Thirty-six. Two and a little bit more pounds. Thirty-two ounces is 2 pounds. Thirty-six is 2 pounds, 4 ounces.
We're looking at about 5 pounds of meat for the 6,000 calories. I don't think I could do it, doc.
You have to work up to it. I don't think you can do this. If you go over to Dali's across the street, get 2 pounds of brisket and work your way through that with coleslaw. You need to have their coleslaw. The coleslaw will help cut some of that fat.
You told me that vegetables are trying to kill me.
They are, but coleslaw will help you eat the brisket. There is a balance for some of these things. Some things need a little bit of vegetables so that you can eat more meat.
You have weird rules. I don't know if I believe all of them, but I think you might BS-ing some people here.
I didn’t say I'm always a carnivore. I'm saying I'm mostly carnivore and if when people are like, “Doc, where are we going to go eat?” I'm like, “I don't care. Just find me a place that has beef.” I was thinking about this at lunch. The next time we are looking at steakhouses, my rule will be who has a 2-pound ribeye on their menu. I won't care who it is. That's where I want to eat.
Let's put that away. That's a lot of meat.
It is. I like a lot of meat.
I think that should be the name of the show.
I thought the show was going to be Cookie Monster.
No. I like a lot of meat.
It's probably going to be Cookie Monster. Folks, you'll know because you'll see it before you hear about this. I think that's a good place for us to end because I need to go get some bacon and some eggs.
I'm starting to get slap-happy.
Dr. Bagley, where are they going to find you?
Precision Chiropractic. We are on the West side of St. Louis. You can find me at PrecisionChiroSTL.com.
I'm glad I'm not too far from where you're at as far as the slap-happy either. I'm at KeystoneChiroSPI.com. Keystone Chiropractic in Springfield, Illinois. Folks, make sure you like, subscribe, and hit that thumbs-up button. Tell people about it. Share the show because, quite honestly, I'm hearing weird things about the algorithms not sharing stuff. This is a health show. This is not sponsored by any of the pharmaceutical companies.
I don't want them to sponsor us. I think we should be sponsored by Merck.
Of course, I heard an alternative news podcast that I was listening to sponsored by ABC and I'm like, “They will take that money.” Folks, you have a good one. We'll be back for another episode. Have a good one.
What have you noticed with our healthcare system nowadays? Today, we will take a look at our healthcare system and dive deep into our health. In this episode, Dr. Bagley and Dr. Schurger talk about their experiences with the keto rash, how our "health care system" is sickness care, and how to unlock your health today! They also share Dr. Peter McCullough's spike detox protocol (on Dr. Schurger's Fullscript site). Let's unpack some valuable wisdom from Dr. Bagley and Dr. Schurger today. So, tune in to this episode now!
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We've got a fun show.
We always have a fun show.
I believe this one is going to come out at the beginning of 2024. This should be the first of 2024.
I wouldn't mind good snow. I'm going to be honest.
I would like good snow during the night. It's all dug out before we even see patients because I,
I like it on a weekend. I'm not worrying about patients because I worry about my patients. Some of them plan two weeks in between appointments or a month. This was their time. They've been waiting to come in, and they can't.
What's funny is I started a new patient. He owns a wrecker business. He's driving around. He's got a flatbed truck.
It’s like a tow truck.
They’re called wreckers.
I heard wreckers sell records.
There's nothing wrong with that. We were joking. He was telling me about some of his cases. He's got to get under cars to get them onto a flatbed or a traditional wrecker and tow them to wherever they need to go. There is a lot of heavy equipment moving around heavy cars. He was telling me about how he had one case where his helper was somehow someone in a Walmart parking lot hit one of the concrete pylons. It's a parking lot. Do not drive in excess of about fifteen miles per hour. Even then, be aware of people around you because some people are cutting across lanes.
The car is on its side. As his helper was trying to bring it back up, he landed it on the pylon. The firefighters had to come in and help undo it. It was a nightmare. His comment was that he wished it would only rain at night and that we shouldn't be out driving at night. It's a great combination. Reality doesn't work that way, but it sounds good in mind.
Maybe it was a win. I don't know.
I'm coming around to the wind. It was the snow comment and not having snow. We don't like snow during patient hours or patient days.
I don't want to miss my patients.
I don't either. I'm over in Arthur every other week. That completely messes up my schedule if I miss one. Their schedules don't necessarily allow us to shift it one week. Sometimes, we can move it to a Friday, but that doesn't always work, not for everyone and with my schedule. We know the snow and the weather is coming, but we're not looking forward to it except on the weekends.
The testimonial that I want to share is about a lady in her mid-70s who was referred by another one of my patients because she was in bad pain. When she went to the hospital, she was getting an X-ray, trying to figure out why she was in such bad pain. My patient was like, “You need to see Dr. Schurger.” She comes on over here. I work her in as quickly as I can.
I do a range of motion before I check all my patients. I figure out how well you can tip your head forward, backward, and side to side. It’s not my favorite motion there. Simple rotation, turning your head left and right. People take these for granted. They don't think a whole lot of it, but the big one, more than all the others, especially for driving purposes, is to be able to turn your head left and right. You should be able to put your arms out, not quite straight across, but certainly comfortably across your body, and look down both arms. That's about 80 degrees to either side.
This young lady was at fourteen degrees and 29 degrees to the right. There are yikes for two reasons. One, she's driving. There are a lot of people who are in that situation where they can't turn to look and see what's going on behind them when they're backing out. Two, her pain level was moderate to severe. I tell people, “Gauge your pain by either mild, moderate, or severe.” Sometimes, there's a little bit in between those two. All of her pain was mostly on the right. When turning to the left, she had pain. It was at that moderate to severe level.
Gauge your pain by either mild, moderate, or severe. Sometimes, there's a bit in between those two.
This was October 26th, 2024, when I did the initial evaluation on her. We haven't gotten to do the reevaluation until now. I like to do about a month out. She's closer to six weeks at this point. Not only did she have a better range of motion, all those motions that she had where her pain was moderate to severe, she's now tight in those spots. It is great if you can move fourteen degrees instead of having pain that's driving you crazy.
Now, it's tight. That's great. She is now almost 60 degrees on both sides. As I was going through and telling her and explaining what both she and another patient came in shortly after, for those of you who are reading at home, imagine I've turned, and I'm perpendicular to the camera. If you have good posture, your ear should be over the seam of your shirt.
If you're not watching, it's the most attractive and the best I've ever seen.
The middle of your ear should be over the top of that seam of your shirt. Ideally, that's where you want. If you're slumped over, and that ear is sitting in front of your body, the amount of rotation you have is limited because all of those joints aren't working.
For everyone who is reading, slump forward for me. We're going to slump forward. Try to look up at the ceiling. You got nothing. Sit straight up, like more than you would normally. Look how much further you can go up. When people structurally lose that forward head posture, we call it anterior head syndrome; they've lost not only the side-to-side but also the up. They can usually still go down, but they can't go up anymore because there's a physical barrier that's happening. You can make it happen by faking bad posture.
Let's add one more thing. These are things that, for some people who were like, “I don't care if I can go back further. I don't care if I have this range of motion.” One more posture test that will tell you, “I get it. Slump forward. Take a deep breath.” That's hard. You can't. How many people are living here trying to breathe all the time, and they have horrible sinuses? You sit up tall and take a deep breath.
All of a sudden, you can fill your lungs up so much more.
That proper full upright posture is designed. That way, we can use the full lung capacity. If you are not getting the full lung capacity, you are not getting up into the top parts of your lung, which they call the deep parts, because it goes down, sits at the bottom of your sternum, and comes back up. Not to say that is where cancers always live because when we were taking normal X-rays, we would see the top of the lungs.
It was not uncommon to see a spot of cancer in that part of the lung. Oftentimes, it's all the way throughout. What is going on at the top is that it is not getting a full amount of air into those various pockets. They call them alveoli, which aren't being fully utilized. What happens? Things break down. Chemical biochemical processes don't work.
The actual physical part of them moving creates more health for them. They're supposed to move. That's a good point. I also have one more thing to add because, in our class that I teach on Wednesday nights called Half Hour to Health, I talk about protection posture. If I was to come at you and I was a bear, and I was going to try to swipe at you, your posture would go into protection, which is that forward posture.
If you see somebody who's upset and crying, they're not going to be sitting up straight. They're in protection posture. When we're in a protection posture, all of those things are true. You're not going to breathe and move well. That also usually means you're heading towards sympathetic dominance, which typically means that you're not sleeping and digesting food well. You tend to have anxiety and circular thoughts. All of those things are true.
All of that becomes a bigger problem because we are not addressing those things outside of most chiropractic offices, certainly within our offices. Those are things that we focus on trying to say, “How do we keep you better and healthier?” It was the next thing that I wanted to talk about. We prerecord these. It was the second runner-up Republican debate.
It’s a pointless debate. It's funny. There were some telling things there. Some of these people are vying for cabinet positions in the next administration. Some of them are burning stuff down.
There are some statements that they're making that I'm like, “These are intelligent things we need to think about. How do we change society?” The one comment that stands out, because we've been saying it for years, is that made by Vivek Ramaswamy.
I liked his comment. Go ahead and tell us.
His comment was that we do not have a healthcare system. We have a sick care system. This is something chiropractic has been saying for years since health insurance became a common thing in the 1970s when Nixon brought it in, and Medicare came about.
It messed a whole bunch of stuff up. I'll tell you that.
Everyone's like, “If I got health insurance, it's going to cover all the things that I need to do.” Vivek’s wife is a cancer doctor. She's doing these surgeries that need to be performed, but he made the comment that they are not covered by insurance because the insurance would rather put you on a drug. They make no getting you well and giving you a cure. They make all their money keeping you sick enough that you don't die but not well enough that you can get off the drugs and potential surgeries that you need down the line.
Insurance companies are for profit. One of the issues I see is that I don't think insurance companies should make a profit. They should pay their employees. Their CEO should make a lot of money. That's fine. If they're making a profit, they are not giving out enough benefits, and they're charging too much. Both are happening.
This isn't saying that socialized medicine is a great idea either because it has different problems that will suck money into different things that don't necessarily ever serve. The system is a broken system because we've been looking at it from the wrong perspective. I honestly do not have a problem with for-profit companies, even a healthcare company. I'm not saying the individual groups work, as they're running things now. I'm saying that there is a problem with the system that is different than what is being implemented.
I agree 100% with what you're saying, but I'm going to add the reason I think it shouldn't be for profit. A not-for-profit could be a charitable organization. A lot of hospitals are not for profit. They don't have shareholders, and they're not beholden to shareholders. The profits don't go to shareholders. The profits go back into the hospital conglomerate. I'm not saying all hospitals are great. United Health Group is probably one of the bigger ones. United Healthcare does all sorts of things. In 2022, they made $20 billion of profit. Cigna made $6.7 billion. For CVS Health, I didn't know that they had a health insurance company, but they made $4.2 billion.
I'm not saying that there isn't a problem there. My point is the metrics that they are saying, “Our clients and all the people paying into our system are doing well, are the wrong metrics. We didn't pay this many claims. We got them to this.” More generic drugs are probably part of the answer. I'm not saying that we need these medications. I'm saying that they need to be able to do the research. They also need to be able to do research into things that are pro-health, like chiropractic and stem cell research, which is being stonewalled because the FDA, which has its reasons to do research in a fashion, doesn't understand how these technologies have changed. There's got to be a better way.
I'm not saying I have an answer. I'm not going to get into that business, but I do know that there are ways to do it. The current systems are failing the current, and any of the socialized systems aren't better. Everyone was like, “Look at Canada.” I'm like, Yeah, you have to wait three months to get an MRI. I can order an MRI, and I can walk into a place.” You and I can order MRIs, but I can even get a patient to be able to walk in tomorrow. I’ll have them get an MRI, and I'll have the report by the afternoon.
The current systems are failing, and socialized systems aren't better.
You'll be paying money for it. You have insurance that's covered there. You'll probably have a payment that you still have to pay. In Canada, you walk out.
Here's the question. How much should an MRI cost? Did Jason get any MRIs when he went in? What do you think? When was the last MRI that you heard about as far as the price tag?
It was $800.
Eight hundred dollars is reasonable.
It's a cash pay patient paying for it. It was not in a hospital setting.
We've had full upright MRIs taken for around $350 to $500. My local MRI place will do my X-rays for $50 per region. That's 2 or 3 films for the neck or the lower back. Their MRI is about $500. It is reasonably priced when you understand what they are charging your insurance company. I had a gentleman that I knew that had a full workup. I don't know if he had more than a brain MRI, but I felt like he said it was like $3,000 or $6,000.
You're not wrong. The cost of a neck MRI can range between $500, which is okay because you're getting a radiologist to read and the equipment. You're paying a tech to do it. That seems reasonable. It’s up to $11,000.
There's a disconnect there.
That's why these radiology centers exist. In a hospital setting, in order to make the hospital solvent, they have to charge outrageous prices. The insurance companies don't pay all of that. They pay a portion of it. They've reduced their rates. The patient might pay a portion of it, but in general, they're never going to make $11,000.
The other part of this is the hospitals are not transparent about their pricing. That law is getting passed. It's changing. Oftentimes, if they aren't upfront with you about how much it's going to cost you as an individual, even with your insurance, they can be sued, which is why, and I know you're the same, we always present, “Here are the fees. The exam and the X-ray normally run about $400.” That's how we start our conversations. Some people are like, “Let's get to get down to brass tax stock.”
There are many things in many places, even the nonprofit hospitals. We like to say, “Those nonprofits are the good people.” Most nonprofits, and I'm talking across the board, for every $100 they are collecting, maybe $10 of it gets to the end goal. Everything else is administrative dollars that are running the show. We can't say, “Just because they're a nonprofit, they're good people.” There are good people in these systems.
Some of our best patients are in hospital systems. They know it's broken.
There are many spots along the chain that need to be changed. Even saying, “We're going to say you have X amount of chiropractic visits a year that are dedicated to chiropractic and not to physiotherapy.” That would be a huge starting point. If you can get the patient to lose fifteen pounds, that is a bonus to the people who are involved. These are not metrics that people are trying to measure and influence.
Back to our comment trying to push extra protein, I had a gentleman. He and his wife are trying to do stuff. He's big. His A1C is solid, which is a good bonus for him, but he is overweight. He was like, “The wife and I are trying to cut back on what we're eating.” I'm like, “No, go the other direction.” If you can crush 300 grams of protein, you're not going to eat anything else. You're going to boost your metabolism as your body says, “Let's get rid of this body fat.” In consequence, it's going to be hard because even I have a hard time crushing over 200 grams of protein, but it can be done. How do we help these people understand to go in this direction and not that direction?
You might crave things like carbs at first, but you won't have to be hungry. I have a weird question. Have you ever heard of the keto rash?
I have not. What is this?
I got to know about it because I have a keto rash. I started getting itchy on my back. It is almost like poison ivy, but tiny little bumps. At first, I thought some bugs. What happened? It started spreading. I have a couple of spots on my arm now. It stays mostly on the torso. I was like, “Could it have to do with my diet?” I looked up the keto rash, and all these things came up. It's a real thing. It's rare. I'm glad I got the rare thing.
Someone's got to go through it. I didn't.
I'm not stopping keto because I'm doing it. It's called prurigo pigmentosa.
What drives it?
They don't know. Interesting. It's an uncommon dermatosis consisting of a network of arithmetic, periodic papules evolving into reticulated hyperpigmentation with a specific predilection. There we go for the trunk. It's mostly seen in young adults and mostly women. It doesn't hurt. If I'm not thinking about it, it's itchy. It has not changed. Over the course of a few weeks, it almost looks like liver spots if you look it up, and it does go away.
I wonder if the pigmentation that's come back for me is that.
It's not dangerous. I've looked up a lot of it. I'm wondering if it's yeast die-off and it's a reaction of yeast die-off.
My initial thought is, “What is your body dumping out of your body?”
Yes, because you will dump things through your skin. Even though it says how to get rid of it, one of the ways is to start eating carbs. I was like, “No, I will not do that because I know how much better everything else feels. This is my body processing through something.”
People don't look at the skin as an excretion organ, but it is. We are dumping stuff all the time. Mostly, sweat is what we think of it as, but there's stuff coming out. Sometimes, you have to let that stuff happen. Sometimes, not everything feels good when you heal. We've talked about this in the past.
Some say, “I also could go on doxycycline, and that helps.” I was like, “No, I'm not going to do that.”
The only thing I would add is that this sounds weird until you start playing with it. As I've been making different meat dishes, I end up harvesting all of this extra fat. The beef tallow is a better straight beef. You don't have to add anything to it. It is a good skin moisturizer. You could experiment with that. Bacon grease is a good second because it's bacon.
I like to smell like bacon. That's fabulous.
Samuel will come after you.
The dog will come jumping at me.
Did I tell you the story about how I got pulled through the security line in Las Vegas after the Blair conference?
No.
I haven't shared this with you. I've shared this with Jean, my wife. It's funny. Sunday morning, you're sleeping. You guys stuck around for the rest of the day. I'm flying back. I checked my bag, and I got my normal laptop bag, which was sitting at the back of the office. Otherwise, I'd pull it up. I'm walking through security. Security in Las Vegas has an area that you walk through where the dogs walk past you. I don't know if they're drug-sniffing or bomb-sniffing. I brought some of my tallow balm with me to keep my skin moisturized as I do. I'd put some on after taking a shower that morning. I smell like tallow. I got some essential oils in there. It’s just not tallow.
To a dog, it would smell like beef.
They're going to smell the beef. On top of that, in my bag, I have a plethora of meat stick snacks that I've got with me. I'll give Fire Creek Snacks a shout-out.
If they want to bestow us some products, we would be happy to taste-test them all over.
There are my beef sticks. Those are the originals.
If they'd like to give us some snacks, we'll talk about them.
They're great, and they're great people. We could even reach out to them and say, “Do you want to come on the show?” They wouldn't mind talking about their wellness model. I got pulled, which is not too bad because I got pulled straight to the front of the line. I didn't have to wait through everybody else. They had to do an extra search in my bag, my normal pat down, and things like that.
Here's the other funny part. First off, I got right to the front of the line because I got meat sticks in the back of my bag. The second time, I met the officer at the first checkpoint, as I was supposed to wait before an officer escorted me to the front. I'm chatting with this young man, and he's like, “I want to get your name right. I want to make sure I say Schurger correctly.” My name is tricky to say.
He said his name was Jamerson. Immediately, my brain was like, “That's an easy one to say.” I've been saying Jamerson for years because I'm a bass player. One of my bass player heroes is a guy by the name of James Jamerson, who was like the Motown legend. All of those old Motown hits, some of the Michael Jackson stuff, Stevie Wonder, and all of those old Motown classics were played by James Jamerson, who turns out to be this guy's nephew or uncle. I tell him that, and he is like, “That's my uncle.” It's funny how small a world it is, especially since I lived up in the Detroit area as long as I did. I visited the Motown area, but I never got to the Motown studio properly.
I'm guessing you got released without stealing your beef tallow and beef sticks.
The dog might have wanted a beef stick.
That's a good point. Don't spread bacon grease all over yourself when you're going to the airport.
Sammy might like you extra.
She doesn't like me very much anyway. She didn't even get up off the couch to say when I got home from work. She might be gone. I don't know. She's old. No, my dog is not dead. I had a one-win I wanted to share with you and the readers. I'm going to call him a young man because he is younger than me. He will come on the show at some point. He's new to care now.
He went to a place called the Dizzy Imbalance Center, which is a clinic in St. Louis that does all these cool that'd be amazing to have. The doctor that runs that on here has all of these amazing technologies to help people get better from certain types of dizziness. What this center has realized is that when it's carcinogenic in nature, they have limited help, but if it's like BPPV or with the eyes, they can help a lot. They do amazing work.
I've sent patients to them, and they send patients to me. This young man was told by the doctor, “You have to get this checked out.” He came in with a big misalignment, posterior C2 double misalignment, but on one side. This guy was miserable. Not only was he dizzy and felt awful, but he would feel his neck. He said, “I can feel this big bump on my neck. I felt I was a C2 or C3.” On the X-ray, both sides were misaligned.
He's been getting adjusted for a few weeks. As he was getting downrested, I was like, “I'd love to do a video with you sometime when you're back to your old self.” He goes, “Anytime. I can't wait to talk about it. I'll do all the videos. You've given me my life back.” I go, “I couldn't have done it without you, bud.” That's why I tell people. I was like, “I couldn't have done it without you. You had to show.” He goes, “I showed up.” I was like, “That’s the battle. People have to show up for us to help them.” We can't help them via Zoom or via the show for all of you out there.” We can help you a little bit via the show, but you have to go to the doctor.
People have to show up for us to help them.
This is where I'm like, “People are doing virtual consults and nutritional stuff across the country. There is no virtual adjustment. You have to come into the office to do what we do.”
If you're a billionaire and you want me to fly to a certain area, I go on your yacht.
You have to be careful getting on the yachts.
I don't know. I would get on Elon's yacht.
I wouldn't worry about Elon.
I'd be his friend.
I'd be okay with being Elon's friend. I wouldn't mind being a friend to a lot of those guys.
I've heard Epstein is not a good one. He might still be alive. I'm going to put my tinfoil hat on. They may have faked his death and got him out of prison.
This goes back to my point. There are some yachts you should not get on.
I don't get on that one. You'd have to go back in time, but I don't even know if he had it yet. I'm sure he did.
It was more about the island
Don't get on his plane.
The other thing we were doing before we started was that you had pulled up ChatGPT to do a search. I want to go through this list that they came up with because this list is one more piece to the puzzle that tells me AI is not about to be taking away and getting rid of your doctor or giving better advice than what your doctors already know how to do. This isn't necessarily a doctor's advice.
I asked for ideas for upper-circle chiropractors with an audience of patients and people who would like it. I was like, “That's us. Let's see.” As I read through it, I was like, “Done it.” It is great for us.
Go through the list because we've hit some of these. Some of these are saying the wrong thing because it doesn't understand.
Align your health is a cute chiropractic reference. Discuss the benefits of upper cervical chiropractic care, featuring patient success stories and expert insights.
Align your health.
The reason we have to do this on one level is to share the different things. We don't make South African dripping diabetes go away any better than a migraine. We correct the underlying cause, that neuro-structural shift at the base of your skull that is preventing your body from functioning the way it's supposed to. Everything else, the body, as you said about your other patient, you couldn't have gotten him better without him.
He can't do it without you.
His body is doing the healing.
Your body is a thousand more intelligent than anyone.
What I want to instill in my patients is that you are way more powerful than pharmaceutical companies, the insurance companies, and the medical industrial complex want you to think you are. They want to keep you weak and subservient. They want to keep you to the point where the only way you can get well is with their injections, drugs, and ideas. The truth of the matter is your body is thousands of times more intelligent than any one or many of the doctors, pharmaceutical companies, me, and Dr. Schurger. We are here to empower you to take control of your health. You can do it. We did it. I'll let you know in the next episode if it's gone away. It's driving me crazy.
When we see her hair covered in coconut oil, we will know she is gone.
I've done that before. I do a coconut oil mask. I didn't like it. It wasn't great. I thought that was a good idea. No, I don't recommend it. Dive into the science behind Upper Cervical chiropractic adjustments, educating readers on the impact of spinal health and nervous system function. Family wellness hub, Discuss how upper cervical care benefits families from children to adults, promoting a holistic approach to family health.
That might be one we haven't dove into. We've talked about kids.
We’ve talked about pregnancy.
What's curious is I've got several families that have been coming to me for over a decade now. They know they're doing better when they come in to see us regularly. The one family for the longest time, one of her kids has asthma or two of them. She would take them to the ER every time there was an asthma flareup. Finally, she said, “The kid doesn't have the asthma flareups when we've been in to see Dr. Schurger.” She’s like, “Can you get me in? I know it's an off time, but the kids are having a flareup of asthma.” I'm like, “Sure.” It gets them better, and it calms down.
It's not Dr. Schurger doing that. All he did was check the patient and make sure that there was a subluxation present and a structural shift happening. He already knew the adjustment to give. He gives the adjustment, lets them rest, and hands off, let them heal. We're not going to keep inundating them with chemicals. We let them heal, which is hard for some patients because they might get adjusted and be like, “Doc, it still hurts right here.” I'm like, “Yeah, it's only been fifteen minutes. It's not going to go away that quick.” I would love for it to go away that quickly. If I had the magic wand and I could poof it all away for you, I would do it.”
It's not magic. It's science. Bodies take time to heal, but it is incredible when you see a kid take a deep breath when they haven't been able to do it for a few weeks. It does feel good. I'm going to be honest. I'll give you one more. Pain-free journeys, share patient testimonials about overcoming pain and improving mobility through upper cervical chiropractic treatments. I think you did that.
I did that one now. Are there any nutrition ones on that list?
No.
They didn't even get the good nutrition that we could be talking about. I'm going to throw out a nutrition idea that I heard from Dr. Peter McCullough. Are you familiar with Dr. McCullough?
I love Dr. McCullough. I wish he wasn't popular because we could get him on our little show.
I would love to have him on our show and seminars.
Wouldn't it be incredible if he came to the conference as a keynote speaker?
He would be fantastic. If you don't know who Dr. Peter McCullough is, you are missing out. He does have his own little podcast. He is the most published practicing physician in the country, with over 600 articles published in cardiology. He's a nephrology fellow. The heart and the kidneys have this hormonal interaction that is close to each other. He's one of the few doctors in the country who do both well. For whatever reason, he got roped into the COVID-19 stuff for the longest time at the beginning, trying to figure out what was going on and helping his patient base.
He helped all of his patients get well.
He was looking for a way to solve the problem. There's a lot of back and forth. He's regularly on Fox News about stuff, but he came across something that, as soon as he said it, I'm like, “Yes.” I saw the same thing in my clinic during COVID, but I didn't figure it out until later. I have two supplements that I normally give out or that I recommend during the cold and flu season. One is called Andrographis for MediHerb.
That one has been my go-to for years. Whenever my sinuses start acting up, within about a couple of days, it will kill and stop. It kicks up my immune system so that I break down whatever's attacking. Within about 2 to 3 days, it's done. If I'm out of adjustment, I'll start taking them and go get adjusted. Within about 4 to 8 hours, everything is cleared up, and I don't need to take it anymore. It tastes horrible.
It works great for everything except for apparently Coronaviruses. It didn't hit it, but all of my patients, some of them, didn't like that, but they liked this herbal throat spray, which is primarily clove, and they loved it. Most of those people who were on that and using that on the regular didn't have a problem with COVID because there's an anti microbial bacterial effect from the clove. You don't need a fancy spray. This is for everyone who's coming off the holidays, and you're like, “My immune system is taxed from everything I did over the holidays.” You can simply take a whole clove and chew on it. There's going to be a numbing effect.
It numbs, which, if you have a toothache, is not a bad idea.
It's also going to help clean up some of the stuff in your mouth as far as any bugs that aren't supposed to be there and help balance things out.
Chew on a clove. What about clove cigarettes? Is that okay?
I would say stay away from clove cigarettes. Anything that is a cigarette has bigger problems.
That's not what we're going to do. We're going to do chewing on a clove. I'm going to try it because I have some in my cabinet.
What's funny is I know more smokers. You'd think smokers have poor lung capacity. No, they want to get every last bit of that nicotine into their lungs. That is half the problem because they destroy the lungs. They know how to take a nice deep breath.
Smokers do not start smoking because I said they did not get COVID as much as non-smokers. |Those smoking killed off the COVID.
It is a two-part thing going on because I don't know how it is in St. Louis. In Illinois, you can't smoke indoors.
There are a few exceptions, like casinos.
You have to go outside and smoke outside. You can't stop because you're addicted. Those people who were smoking were breathing fresh air.
I think it had something to do with how it was probably killing off the airborne.
I'm not saying it's one thing.
Don't start smoking because of that. It's not a good idea. There are many other things that could go wrong.
If you need to get some fresh air, go outside for a 10 to 15-minute walk.
What are your thoughts on vaping?
I don't like it either. There are two problems with vaping. The one is whatever liquid they're suspending it in; apparently, that stuff is toxic as all gets out. There might be a flavor that you like with it, and there might be nicotine. Some of them also have THC.
They could be, depending on what state you're in.
There's some chemical that you've decided that you want out of that. The main chemical that suspends it and allows it to be vaped, everything that I've read about, suggests that it is nasty stuff and you want to stay away from it.
People will say, “It's healthier than smoking.” I don't know if that's true or not. I prefer someone vaping. If someone is going to smoke or vape in my house, I'd say vape because it doesn't stink as bad. Not that I want either of those things, but we're going to find out several years from now that these people have either popcorn lungs or fibrous tissue in their lungs. There's going to be an issue.
We don't see these on TV because most people don't see these commercials running as they used to. Every now and then, you'll see a commercial that says, “If you or a loved one was part of this, that, or the other, here's a class accident lawsuit because you had exposure to asbestos or you had exposure.”
What was the base that my husband was on that base?
I don't know.
In Camp Lejeune, the water was bad there, and that was when my husband was there. We'll see.
There are a lot of those little things like that where these class action lawsuits come out. They say, “If you or a loved one were damaged, that's going to come out on the vaping.” The stuff that I've been reading in the mainstream press is suggesting that all of these liability protections that the jab companies got for the shot are going to go away severely, and there's going to be class action lawsuits against that. The evidence is now mounting that what they did the research on and then what they released to the public were two distinctly different things. They did not do the safety study for the second item that was released to the public.
Have you been following the guy in New Zealand that's now been arrested?
No, I've heard about this.
He had access to the raw data. When he looked at it, we're talking deaths, not like sicknesses but deaths. Some of these lots had 17% of deaths. One lot, which was hot, was 28% of deaths. He couldn't stay silent about it, and God blessed him for that. He's been taken into custody because he spoke the truth.
Unfortunately, we live in a world that's censored. I'm going to let this run normally on YouTube because we're not getting into things. We're sharing the information.
We're not monetized, either.
We're sharing the information that we're hearing about, but we're not proposing anything. If a lawyer can get involved, they're going to do a class action lawsuit. Let's put it that way. I heard someone else say that we are going to come out here in about 10 or 15 years, maybe even not that long, and be accused of this timeframe being such a censorship-heavy time that it's going to be equivalent to the McCarthy era, witch hunts that were going on in the ‘50s and ‘60s. It's scary.
If we can't have discussions about the science and the data and ask questions, does the data line up with what is coming out? Why couldn't they get all of these thousands of pages that Pfizer had that they gave to the FDA? Why couldn't they release all of it immediately? The people who are going through it are overwhelmed trying to get through 25,000 pages a month.
We live in a strange world now. Half the reason we're doing the show is to share the information. When I got into this, and I know when you got into this, we already saw a lot of this on the wall where we're like, “We don't have healthcare in this country. We have sick care.” The best way that you and I both saw independence was getting out of the industries that we were in, where we were told, “Go get your degree.”
Go work for a big corporation.
They're going to take care of you because they're good people. I'm like, “No, they're not.”
I didn't make a lot of money doing that. If I stayed there, I may be making more money than I make now, but I would not have passion for what I would be doing.
You might have sold your soul, sadly.
I would've, and I don't want to be like that. That's not a good place to live.
We wouldn't have these people's lives changed like we have them. I've had several people who say, “Doc, I'm glad you made the change.”
Whether you readers want to believe it or not, I was led to this because I listened to my innate, which to me is God speaking to me. It was, “Do this. Check that out. Look at that sign. What's that?” The journey has been incredible. I've got many years left of the journey to continue to help change lives. Where can they find you, Dr. Schurger?
I am at KeystoneChiroSPI.com. It’s in Springfield, Illinois. I’m on all the socials.
I am at precisionchiropracticstl.com/.
You can go both ways.
It is in the show notes. We do have a link tree that normally gets posted. Hopefully, that's there. If you need to find the stuff, it's all there. That was the other nutritional thing I wanted to post. It’s another Peter McCullough thing. I will be posting a link to my full script for those people who are concerned. Did this jab cause problems? Is the spike protein still potentially circulating in me all these months to years later?
The answer is probably yes to some degree, especially if you are living with COVID-19 or having other problems. There are ways to do to degrade that protein. I will post that in on the full script. It's three real simple supplements. You might need to take it for a year before everything gets cleaned up, but that will be there. Sometimes, you have to start sometime with these things.
Take care.
You have a great one. We will come back we'll be back in another week with another episode. Have a good one. Bye.
Why is wheat making people sick? I think about this a lot and I'm going to break down some of this. There are a lot of theories out there, but overall many people feel better when they don't eat wheat. I'm going to go over 3 theories of why this is happening and my opinion on it: Wheat belly/leaky gut theory for sensitivity, Blood sugar regulation, and intestinal flora die-off. Feel free to comment and let me know what you think, and if I missed something.
I definitely think there is something to this theory, and most WOE (way of eating rather than saying diet) do something to help the intestinal flora. But overall the theory is that the gut in injured by the gluten protein for some people. This then causes the gut to "leak" nutrients and toxins into the blood stream and we can become hypersensitive (and our immune system sorta attacks us). Overall what they recommend is avoiding wheat (sometimes all grains) and added probiotics (fermented foods or a pill). Some WOEs that have helped people are Wheat Belly and GAPS (gut and psychology syndrome) and Paleo.
Wheat is a carbohydrate. So many people don't react well to carbohydrates. Overall these diets restrict wheat, grains and sugars. People tend to lose weight and get more energy by highly restricting carbohydrates, eating moderate protein, and higher amounts of health fats. One fallacy is that some people overeat on the protein. Too much protein actually does effect our blood sugars negatively. The most famous of these WOEs is Atkins. Paleo or Primal eating is a mixture of this and Grain Free but allows for fruit. I absolutely think this works to help people lose wight and by default it restricts wheat, but since people may not realize that the grain restriction is what is making them feel better, when they cheat, they assume the blood sugar spike is what causes bloat, weight gain and feeling icky. It actually could be their body reacting to wheat or grain product they eat.
So some more research is going into what certain foods do to our intestinal Flora. There are definitely some apposing views on this... Pro and Con. The theory goes like this. Some wheat is harvested a week or so after the entire field is sprayed with roundup (glyphosate) to kill the wheat so it can be harvested. I don't think all farmers do this, but some do. So very small amount of the herbicide roundup can be detected in the flour that is used to make the products. When consumed the roundup will destroy some beneficial bacteria in the gut which changes the way our gut makes and digests certain nutrients. This has a detrimental effect on the whole body. There is no trendy diet with this theory other than avoiding any product or produce that has been sprayed with glyphosate.
So i think there could be truth to all these theories. This is why someone who doesn't have Celiac Disease still benefits from a wheat free diet. In my opinion a more primal diet is better which avoids many grains. Celiac disease is something different from these theories of sensitivity. What do you think? How do you feel when you are off wheat or all grains? I know I feel better with less body pain, my energy goes up, my mind is sharper and I definitely don't have as much bloating in my gut. Share your story in the comments.
Thanks for reading!
Dr. Bagley
Do you have a St. Louis Chiropractor? Call us today if you are looking for help 314-596-4070
We recently had a Patient Appreciation Day and food drive to support the Kirk Care Food Pantry. I have to say, it was the biggest success because, (and I have to brag) but we have the best chiropractic patients in St. Louis. Your donations filled up an ENTIRE truck and the volunteers from Kirk Care were blown away. Here are some fun pictures from that day!!
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| Barb (Dr. B's Mom) helped out in the front! |
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| Liz Menedez donated her time to do Chair Massage... Ahhh so nice! |
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| Just the beginning.... our patients were so generous! |
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| Some of our fav's stopped by! |
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| It's overflowing... so we started collecting outside. Good thing the weather was nice. |
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| Crisy and Dr. Bagley overjoyed with how much was given! |
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| It really did fill up a truck. Woo Hoo! |
I'll be honest... this day was one of the top 10 days in my entire career. I'm so proud of our office and what we have accomplished, I'm so proud to be your chiropractor. Thank you so much for trusting me to help you on your health journey.
Need a St. Louis Chiropractor? Call us at 314-596-4070 today... we can help you!!
Wow, is it hard for me to get 20 minutes let alone 5 minutes to myself to meditate. First of all, I am so easily distracted. One little noise or my kids in the other room doing something that they know they shouldn’t be doing, and my brain is not in the right place. I definitely don’t make that time for myself but I know how good it is for me. I’ve come up with a way to do a 1 minute meditation that has really helped me be present and calm, and I'd like to share it with you. It may not be “actual” meditation but for this busy working momma, it works. Ok, here’s how I do it:
This week I watched a documentary (The age of Aluminum) about something I already thought I knew about, Aluminum. So I started questioning practice members in my office this week, “does anyone else know about aluminum.” The short answer is NO. The possible links that are being researched are a little scary. Things like Alzheimers, brest cancer, and allergies are just some of them.
1. Antiperspirant- aluminium zirconium tetrachlorohydrex gly , aluminium zirconium trichlorohydrex gly, Aluminium chloride, aluminium chlorohydrate, and aluminium-zirconium are the most common types of aluminum in antiperspirants. How they work is that the aluminum makes a bond with the electrolytes in the sweat and it forms a gel plug in the sweat gland duct. The worry is that it is possible that aluminum in leaching into the surrounding tissues, especially breast tissue which it is closest to. Research being done in vitro (out of the body) show that breast cells exposed to aluminum will grow tumors. The aluminum lobby says, “this is bogus” but to me it sounds a lot like what the tobacco lobby used to say about lung cancer. ALTERNATIVE: use deodorant (aluminum free) or magnesium oil.2. Vaccines- I know there is much controversy over vaccines and our health. But one incontrovertible fact is that vaccines have aluminum in them as something called an adjuvant which “improves the immune response” of those who receive the vaccine. Well here’s something I didn’t know before, aluminum hydroxide is used to MAKE animals allergic to things so we can study them. So, to put it another way, when we inject these animals with aluminum, it makes them allergic to eggs, wheat, soy, or whatever they choose to introduce at the same time. This Articleis one example of this. There is also some speculation into how vaccines can be related to dementia (read more on number 4). ALTERNATIVE: don’t get vaccines..
3. Cookware- My grandfather used to tell my mother, never let something sit too long in an aluminum pot. He was sort of ahead of his time, a chiropractor and in love with health knowledge. Tons of cookware is made with aluminum. Probably not such a great idea now that we know that aluminum is toxic. I think of it similarly to pewter. People used to get lead poisoning from using pewter for cooking, now it is made with tin instead of lead, so it goes to show that metal can leach out of cookware. ALTERNATIVE: Stainless steel or Cast Iron, also avoiding cooking with aluminum foil and whenever possible buy your beverages in glass bottles.
4. Antacids- Some antacids are made with aluminum like Gaviscon. Check out these side effects. Aluminum toxicity is a real problem. Some people cannot process it as well as others and it has been related to Alzheimer’s (or Alzheimer’s like symptoms) and even Autism spectrum disorder. Aluminum is classified in this articleas an excitotoxin (meaning exciting neurons to death). ALTERNATIVE: a different antacid whose ingredients don’t have aluminum like Tums or changing your eating habits to include less or no sugar and low carbohydrate/high protein and fat drastically reduces or eliminates heartburn (this is very true for me).
5. Baking Powder- Who would have thought something as simple as baking powder lurking in our pantry could increase our exposure to aluminum. In normal baking powder one of the ingredients is sodium aluminum sulfate. ALTERNATIVE: Aluminum-free baking powder, it is sold in most grocery stores now.
So those are the 5 ways my family avoids aluminum toxicity. I’m sure we all still have some exposure like from eating out at restaurants and things we may not be able to control. But in general, we follow the alternatives listed above and I’m hoping that my kids will have reduced chance of sickness as they get older.
Yours in health,Dr. Beth Bagley
Need a St. Louis Chiropractor? If you have any questions or want more information call us at 314-596-4070 to schedule a private consultation with me.
It is always amazing to me how the body can heal itself when it is free from interference. Here's the latest success story from our clinic.
"Over the last six years I have searched for help and answers for my neck, shoulder and lower back pain. I have tried other types of chiropractic measures. This would help with the pain and lack of mobility as long as I kept going and got the adjustments to put me back together again. I also tried physical therapy, which worked on the shoulder and caused the back to fare up. So that was stopped and the lower back was worked on and then the shoulder would become a problem again. I needed some relief that would help my entire body.
After seeing my x-rays and having all my questions answered I made the commitment to invest in my health. This was in the beginning of November, a couple of months later my husband said that he thought the treatment was working because I was not in as much pain as I normally was. My daughter said she could see the difference in my coloring, I look healthier. Just last month I was able to walk the entire path of our favorite park without pain. (I am looking for some warm weather to start up walking again).
This was the best decision I made for myself and hope you also take the time to help yourself get into good health."
-Mary W.
Thank you so much for your kind words Mary. It has and continues to be a pleasure to serve you!
Yours in health,
Dr. Beth BagleyNeed a St. Louis Chiropractor? If you have any questions or want more information call us at 314-596-4070 to schedule a private consultation with me.